Immersion the problem with computer games. - Game|Gravity

ghost · 12-25-2008, 03:26 AM

I read an article over at Game Set Watch regarding something we've all known for a long time. They're using complicated boffin talk to simple say, Triple A games are being designed with graphics and pretty bits (Immersion) vs Game Play. Im glad somebody else thinks companies like EA and Activiion bringing out rehash games with pretty graphics is a bad thing for the industry.

You can read the article here

A simple way to undertand the truth of whatcs going on is to think about those first games you played. Myself Im thinking my favorite Genre is the RPG. SO I'm going to compare my favorite old school rpg Wonder boy in Monster Land (Wonder boy II or III it's been a long time) and compare it to a newer rpg. Ok before anyone says the obvious I want it stated that I truly enjoyed Morrowind, I though Oblivion was overated but good and Fallout III was awesome, as can be seen by my reviwe of it on the forums here so i have to pick another one. Let's say Mass Effect. Im going to be honest and say that I played Wonder boy for longer than I played Mass Effect. I still remember that bloody tune when it comes up on a site or in an add for wonder boy but I couldn't remember the theme for mass effect. Remember it's been at least 10 years since I played wonder boy I played Mass Effect less than three a months ago.

Mass Effect was big budget, probably had a team of designers and developers working for years. The marketing alone would be a thousand times the cost of wonderboy III's development. It's probably 10 000x the size I would have to find a rom to find out. Wonder Boy III 9/10 as a game. Mass Effect was a massive dissapointment. 7/10 (Not a poor score really but certainly not what I would have wanted from an immersive Role Play Experience.)

I was wondering if anybody else had some similar comparisons. We could list the classics against there modern day dissapointements.

Sain · 12-26-2008, 04:03 PM

I think it happens most of the time with new games, since we expect a lot more than we did before. I will use my forever and ever examples. Lineage II, I keep playing that game, cause no other MMORPG has had the same impact, at least on my likings, to be totally inmersed, to roleplay in my mind while I play. I spend a lot of time in L2 just "rping" alone and I find it fun, I tried with many other MMOs and I can't really do it, cause I get bored too easily.

But, if we want to compare old games to new ones. I will say that one game that really immerse you is Super Mario Galaxy. I mean I didn't have enough fun with a single player games as in SMG, it does what all the marios do but way better, it is just a 100/100 game, really if you wanna try a very good game, you should try it. I never really liked any Mario before, but Galaxy is just plain awesome. I think this paragraph is about a good immersive game.

ghost · 12-26-2008, 05:21 PM

I'm not sure if were using immersion in the same sense. A fully immersive game (Of today's standards) would be along the lines of Crysis, trying to make a game that completely simulates reality in another form. Commonly it's considered that nintendo is ignoring this idealistic 'immersion' style of development in favor of games that are just that, games.

The article refers to board games (Even D&D as a board game but it is an exception to the rule) as Rule based games. They rely on rule sets rather than immersion. At no stage during a game of monopoly does it feel like your sleeping in a hotel. However during a game along the lines of Farcry 2 you are supposed to feel like your crawling through the jungle.

In the case of Super Mario Galaxies you've got a game based on a ruleset, trying to provide a fun experience. As opposed to the 'simulation' that would create an immersive experience. I'd have to play Mario Galaxies to fully put it in perspective and I hope to grab a copy soon.

ShadowRG · 01-16-2009, 05:47 AM

i would have to say i've had a good experiance with crysis, but an even better one with timeshift.

as for the comparing old V new, i go back to the old 386/486 days of commander keen, yup you heard right, commander keen, now thats old. if you could call it an RPG i dunno, but it was a blast and kept me going for hours, even SOE's starwars galaxies, has some immersion to it, yes i actualy felt like i was flying a vaksai or a X-wing advanced,

i do agree the most the games that come out these days, arnt so
Immersive as they should be, i believe it boils down to the story line of the game more then graphics and shiny bits.

12-25-2008, 03:26 AM	#1 (permalink)
ghost revenant Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Australia Posts: 454	Immersion the problem with computer games. I read an article over at Game Set Watch regarding something we've all known for a long time. They're using complicated boffin talk to simple say, Triple A games are being designed with graphics and pretty bits (Immersion) vs Game Play. Im glad somebody else thinks companies like EA and Activiion bringing out rehash games with pretty graphics is a bad thing for the industry. You can read the article here A simple way to undertand the truth of whatcs going on is to think about those first games you played. Myself Im thinking my favorite Genre is the RPG. SO I'm going to compare my favorite old school rpg Wonder boy in Monster Land (Wonder boy II or III it's been a long time) and compare it to a newer rpg. Ok before anyone says the obvious I want it stated that I truly enjoyed Morrowind, I though Oblivion was overated but good and Fallout III was awesome, as can be seen by my reviwe of it on the forums here so i have to pick another one. Let's say Mass Effect. Im going to be honest and say that I played Wonder boy for longer than I played Mass Effect. I still remember that bloody tune when it comes up on a site or in an add for wonder boy but I couldn't remember the theme for mass effect. Remember it's been at least 10 years since I played wonder boy I played Mass Effect less than three a months ago. Mass Effect was big budget, probably had a team of designers and developers working for years. The marketing alone would be a thousand times the cost of wonderboy III's development. It's probably 10 000x the size I would have to find a rom to find out. Wonder Boy III 9/10 as a game. Mass Effect was a massive dissapointment. 7/10 (Not a poor score really but certainly not what I would have wanted from an immersive Role Play Experience.) I was wondering if anybody else had some similar comparisons. We could list the classics against there modern day dissapointements. Last edited by ghost; 12-25-2008 at 03:33 AM.

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12-26-2008, 04:03 PM	#2 (permalink)
Sain Action Boy Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 58	I think it happens most of the time with new games, since we expect a lot more than we did before. I will use my forever and ever examples. Lineage II, I keep playing that game, cause no other MMORPG has had the same impact, at least on my likings, to be totally inmersed, to roleplay in my mind while I play. I spend a lot of time in L2 just "rping" alone and I find it fun, I tried with many other MMOs and I can't really do it, cause I get bored too easily. But, if we want to compare old games to new ones. I will say that one game that really immerse you is Super Mario Galaxy. I mean I didn't have enough fun with a single player games as in SMG, it does what all the marios do but way better, it is just a 100/100 game, really if you wanna try a very good game, you should try it. I never really liked any Mario before, but Galaxy is just plain awesome. I think this paragraph is about a good immersive game.

12-26-2008, 05:21 PM	#3 (permalink)
ghost revenant Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Australia Posts: 454	I'm not sure if were using immersion in the same sense. A fully immersive game (Of today's standards) would be along the lines of Crysis, trying to make a game that completely simulates reality in another form. Commonly it's considered that nintendo is ignoring this idealistic 'immersion' style of development in favor of games that are just that, games. The article refers to board games (Even D&D as a board game but it is an exception to the rule) as Rule based games. They rely on rule sets rather than immersion. At no stage during a game of monopoly does it feel like your sleeping in a hotel. However during a game along the lines of Farcry 2 you are supposed to feel like your crawling through the jungle. In the case of Super Mario Galaxies you've got a game based on a ruleset, trying to provide a fun experience. As opposed to the 'simulation' that would create an immersive experience. I'd have to play Mario Galaxies to fully put it in perspective and I hope to grab a copy soon.

01-16-2009, 05:47 AM	#4 (permalink)
ShadowRG Atom Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 19	i would have to say i've had a good experiance with crysis, but an even better one with timeshift. as for the comparing old V new, i go back to the old 386/486 days of commander keen, yup you heard right, commander keen, now thats old. if you could call it an RPG i dunno, but it was a blast and kept me going for hours, even SOE's starwars galaxies, has some immersion to it, yes i actualy felt like i was flying a vaksai or a X-wing advanced, i do agree the most the games that come out these days, arnt so Immersive as they should be, i believe it boils down to the story line of the game more then graphics and shiny bits.